I came across a long-form essay in Aeon by Carlo Iacono, a university librarian, titled Books and screens. Mr. Iacono argued against the idea that phones and other modern technological innovations are driving us toward a post-literate society. I would broadly break his argument into two parts while otherwise encouraging you to read it and reach your own conclusions. Firstly, he compared the fear that technology is leading to a post-literate society to critiques of other “changes in how knowledge moves through society,” covering everything from 19th century periodicals to 20th century comic books. Secondly, he argued against the belief that “literacy [is] primarily about decoding text,” and favoring instead looking at literacy as a multi-domain phenomenon encompassing books and long-form texts, podcasts, videos, and more. The issue, he suggests, is not different ways of absorbing knowledge, but choosing “[b]etween habits that cultivate human potential and platforms that extract human attention.”

While I encourage everyone to read the essay because it is thoughtful and offers plenty to think about, I disagreed with some of the central arguments, or at least how they were presented, for reasons which are largely beyond the scope of what I want to cover here. If only to note where I disagree, I single out two broad points while avoiding particulars. Firstly, one complaint I have had with numerous essays that argue that some concerns about tech and screens today are exaggerated by comparing extreme “hot take” style takes about tech today to similarly overwrought takes about “changes in how knowledge moves through society” from the past (see e.g., televisions, video games, and all of the examples Mr. Iacono uses). This glosses over some reasonable concerns about current technology trends and also past trends. Secondly, while I accept the value of learning in different domains, I would note that learning has been a multi-domain phenomenon throughout history (or even in my 12th grade English class, which predated many of the phenomena at issue in the essay), and it is not necessarily the case that every “new” domain (or fad) is of great value, much less of equal value to sitting down and wrestling with a text borne of clear thinking. But to conclude this section on a positive note, I am entirely in accord with, when examining technology, distinguishing between technology that tends to “cultivate human potential” and “platforms that extract human attention.”

One passage from Mr. Iacono’s essay jumped out at me:

Some people have learned to … listen to podcasts during walks when their minds can wander productively…

Carlo Iacono

Long-time readers will know that I am a proponent of walking. But I am a proponent of attending to one’s walks. For example, in my 2020 essay Walking with Epictetus in the Snow, I cited favorably to Epictetus’ comparing taking care while walking “not to step on a nail or turn your foot” to being “careful not to hurt the ruling faculty of your mind.” While Epictetus’ main focus was on that ruling faculty, there is a lesson for walking there. The lesson is not just avoiding sprained ankles, but also paying attention to the world around you. Listening to podcasts or audiobooks is not entirely consistent with taking advantage of a walk to appreciate the world around you, especially if much of your non-walking time is occupied by screens and the like.

Snow-covered hill (Columbia Heights) leading down from Brooklyn Heights into DUMBO, seen on February 1, 2026.
This is Columbia Heights street in Brooklyn Heights, descending into DUMBO (Old Fulton Street) at the bottom of the hill. I took this photo on February 1, 2026, using my now-former Ubuntu Touch camera app on my Google Pixel 3a XL.

I will confess to being a bit “triggered” (as the kids and commentators say) by Mr. Iacono’s “when their minds can wander productively” line, because my first thought when I hear about using walks to listen to podcasts and the like is of the sort of productivity “hacks” (or, less charitably, productivity porn) that I inveighed against in my 2021 piece An Essay on Productivity, Production, and Productive Leisure. In that essay, I wrote and humbly quote:

Walking is good, by the way. While you should not take life advice from random internet writers, you should take walks. Attend to your surroundings and, if applicable, your company. Take in the air and even take some pictures of pretty things.

Nicholas A. Ferrell

My essay was largely concerned with ends and means. I argued that to the extent one is concerned with productivity, it should be with an eye toward productively achieving a desirable end. Much of the productivity discourse omits the end, turning a vague idea of productivity into the end in and of itself and ultimately collapsing on itself. While I do not think (to the best of my recollection) that I was specifically addressing attempts to optimize walks, the ingredients of such a critique are there in my quote. I recommended walking as good in and of itself (a proper end, unlike ill-defined productivity), and suggested that walkers take time to attend to their surroundings, enjoy their company (if not walking solo), glean a sense of the season, and take a few nice photographs of their surroundings. There is a place for company, or Socrates would not have done so much walking and talking. Company is of course different than a podcast. You can appreciate a good walk with company. The podcast (or video) cannot appreciate your surroundings.

(But what if the podcast is a dramatic reading of one of Plato’s dialogues?)

I note the foregoing not to say that there is never a time that one may want to listen to a podcast while walking. Perhaps some walks call for a podcast or audiobook (not my cup of tea here in Brooklyn, New York City, but I do not enjoy every tea). But at a minimum, I would suggest saving some time for appreciating walking for its own sake.

Walking is not something to optimize.

Of course, if one attends to his or her walks in accordance with my recommendations, he or she may find that un-optimized walking can be the most optimized walking. Speaking from my perspective as someone who publishes many words on the internet, I have found many more ideas by paying attention to my surroundings and thinking on walks than I would have if I spent my walks listening to podcasts. I quote from Adam Singer’s Your mobile device is ruining your creativity (and perhaps your life) (editor’s note: speak for yourself) essay on his deceptively named Hot Takes blog:

There is significant evidence to suggest creativity thrives in moments of solitude and contemplation.

Adam Singer

Mr. Singer was writing about excessive phone usage generally, but I think his broad critique applies with force to “learning” how to listen to podcasts while walking. The brain does not need to be flooded with information 24/7. The brain is unlikely to “wander” while taking in a podcast. But what if you attend to the world around you like Minori Kamiake, one of the two main characters of a Japanese visual novel called May Sky:

[H]ave you ever looked outside and felt ‘life’ all around you this season? [O]f sprouting grass … of newborn leaves … the stems that grow … the tender breeze .. wisteria .. and peonies .. the sweetest scent of freshest tea … it takes a forest … or a wilderness. Not a village .. I think you’ll know what I’m talking about if you go to a place where nature can seek you out. And when it finds you – the smell of the plants, the song of the trees – you feel ‘life’ like never before.

Minori Kamiake (May Sky)

(See my review of May Sky and my analysis article containing the above quote from the novel.)

Are ideas on walks more likely to come from listening to pre-recorded audio or appreciating the world around you, vying for your attention, either on your own or with company? To be sure, there’s an element of longing in Minori’s quote (and audience), but one of the points of her quote is that there are things worth noticing around us so long as we take the time to look outside of ourselves and see them.

Fallen, hallowed out tree seen in the Brooklyn Botanic Garden in March 2025.
I took this photo at the Brooklyn Botanic Garden on March 29, 2025, using the GrapheneOS camera app on my Google Pixel 6a.

Mr. Singer concluded his essay:

Remember, as Archimedes commented on centuries ago, our greatest ‘Eureka!’ moments arise when we least expect them, and certainly not when we’re flooding our brain with information – useful or otherwise.

Adam Singer

There are times and places for many modes of learning. So too there are times and places for contemplation. Regardless of which modes of learning one prefers, one can always attend to a walk without being encumbered by thoughts of optimization or the thoughts of others delivered in prerecorded form.